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Maryevelyn Murray 00:01
Hi. This is MaryEvelyn Murray here at the Seven Sisters farm with<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 00:06
I’m Janice Fine.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 00:07
Awesome, and we’re just going to go ahead and get started. So what does a typical day look like at this point of the season for you, or for like on the farm work in general right now,<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 00:19
we are still pretty heavy in harvesting. So, you know,really, our typical days revolve around what needs to be harvested. Then that’s our most time sensitive. You know, work point that we have. So right now we grow all season, four seasons. So the fall, I mean, we’ve been having really beautiful weather in the fall in North Carolina for really as long as we’ve been doing this. So right now, we have about 20 different items that we can harvest during the week. So kind of, that’s our main focal point for the week, is what needs to be harvested when. And so we kind of base the rest of our work projects and around that item, we are kind of done with planting right now. That’s another main thing that we kind of have to base our days around during the season. So now my husband is moving into kind of what he calls his project season, which is fixing things, building things, and kind of closing stuff down for the winter. I do homeschool our kids, so I am trying to back off quite a bit. So a lot of my days right now do focus around getting the kids started for the day. They’re pretty independent, but, you know, I’ve been really trying to get them on a good track for the day. So that’s kind of been my main focus. And also our markets, you know, we have our farm stand open three days a week. So some days, you know, focus around getting that up and going, and then also prepping all the product for our market is a really main focus of certain days, yeah.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 02:03
When is your market open? Like throughout the year.<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 02:06
So our main outlets right now are a farm stand. Our farm stand is open right now three days a week, Wednesday through Friday. We open full season hours, typically the middle of April, that’s when we start asparagus and plants. So that’s how we kind of kick off our season. And then we run through the middle of December weather, depending if it doesn’t get too cold, and then we shut down our main season hours. Then we do run winter markets. So the weekends that we do go to our winter market, we do offer limited hours on Fridays for our local customers to come choose from what we’ve harvested for the market.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 02:46
Yeah, so when you’re harvesting for like this point of the season, maybe what sort of stuff are you harvesting right now?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 02:54
We’re pretty much into our fall crops right now. We just finished tomatoes. We’ve been extending our tomato season, but we found because that’s one of our most popular products, like what we’re known for, but we found that once you get into the cooler months, they’re not as desirable for our customers. They just don’t taste as good. So we’ve kind of started cutting that back a little bit one of our most popular crops right now, carrots, beets, broccoli, cabbages.<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 03:23
We do, like a lot of the traditional field greens, collards, kale, turnip greens, then we do a lot of salad products. So arugula, several different lettuces, radishes, salad, turnips, peppers are still going right now, but your fall, you move may more into like greens and salad products, whereas in the summer, we do a lot more of the fruit crops, we kind of have a weird balance and a leg up on some of the other smaller market vendors that we grow with, because we do have access to about six acres so we can grow some of the fruiting crops, like watermelons and a lot of tomatoes, a lot of cucumbers, squashes in the summertime.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 04:14
Yeah, what would you say is your most lucrative crop? Or, like, best, I know you mentioned, tomatoes are a good seller.
tomatoes are a good seller.<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 04:19
I mean, one of our best sellers probably, is tomatoes. They’re just very traditional, I mean, and that’s what people think about, what the summertime here and strawberries, we do grow strawberries. They’re definitely not our most lucrative crop, probably one of our more popular crops, as far as you know, some of our better money makers. You know, squash and cucumbers tend to be very reliable. Your lettuces are very reliable. Carrots have been really great for us because they do take a little bit more management to grow when we’ve kind of honed in our management on them a lot, and they’re really popular. Um. We found that the less people have to cook things that the more, you know, people don’t have time to prep a lot of product and do a lot of cooking. So we try to kind of focus on things that are easier for people, easier for people with kids, don’t take as much work, and are kind of a little bit more like dynamic in the kitchen, you know, like your cucumbers and your carrots, your fruits, your tomatoes, your lettuces, they’re just a little bit easier for people to prepare and that people are more familiar with, because we found a big aspect of this is educating our customers. A lot of people just don’t know what to do with the product. They would love to buy it. But I don’t encourage anybody to buy anything that they don’t know what to do with, because it’s just going to end up being a waste. So we spend a lot of time talking to our customers about, like, what can you do with this? How can you prep it easily? So because we want them to be comfortable with the product in order to want to buy it and really use it. I don’t want people to have, you know, waste money on the idea of buying something just because it seems exciting, but then not know what to do. So,<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 06:13
Yeah, what kind of like is that just like from talking with people at, like, the various places you sell your stuff, or?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 06:18
Yeah, a lot of our interaction is face to face. Neither Michael or I are very good at computer things, so that is something as I’m trying to back off from being out in the field a lot like that I kind of need to step up on is more marketing and particularly like educational just like educating our customers, but yeah, most of our interaction is face to face, like we’re a very face to face kind of dynamic with the farm. You know, that’s why he does, like telling at the farmers market, and I’m very we have a couple people that do work with us and help us in the stand. And our stand is honor based when we can’t be up there, but we do interact with the customer quite a bit.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 07:10
Yeah, and for farmers markets as well. Do you go personally most of the time? Or is it…<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 07:14
I do not anymore. I used to. I used to till we till I got pregnant with our daughter, and then it just got to be too much with all the kids. But Michael is there every week.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 07:26
Yeah. And what all farmers markets do you go to outside of your own stand?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 07:32
We are at the Uptown Farmers Market in Charlotte. And then we also have a friend of ours that sells at the Piedmont Triad market, which is in, like Colfax, Kernersville area. He works here for us, and then takes some of our product up there.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 07:47
What all or, I guess, what are the main farms that you’ve worked with before, like, whether for that or for just in general?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 07:54
So Cherry Hill Farm, we’ve done quite a bit with them. Barbie farm, they’re in Concord, which at our uptown farmers market, we can have a partner vendor. So he’s, like, on our list. So, you know, when we’re short on things, he grows about like, 60 acres of produce and quite a bit strawberries and peaches. So he’s one of our main partners. They’re a friend of ours. He usually, really, he has, like chicken houses, but he grows quite a bit of produce. It’s called Second Creek Farm in Denton. There’s a couple just like guys around Denton that grow grain, and they supplement us with corn quite a bit, because we just don’t have the space to grow corn. And then Newman farm there in Hendersonville, that’s where we get our apples for the season, which there are other partner vendor at the Uptown farmers market. Because the Uptown farmers market, it’s a really good market, but it’s not large enough to draw in some like the more specialty producers that like all they produce is one thing. It’s just not worth it for them to come spend their whole day there. So we do have a couple. Michael carries the weight of like being a partner vendor with a couple people there to bring in a variety of product for the customers. I’m trying to think of their name yet. And then the guy that works for us, J and s farm, who is at Piedmont tribe market. He does quite a few bedding plants and cut flowers and so he we kind of like trade a few things back and forth with him.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 09:29
Yeah, um, do you all end up helping out other farms in the area as well? Or is that mostly like at markets, or in specific, like trading produce and things like that?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 09:41
As far as like for product or ideas, or?<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 09:45
Just yeah, like a general collaboration?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 09:47
Yeah, we do we we’re probably a little bit more, I mean, you want to say private, but some people are a little bit more like collective minded that are a little. Bit smaller. I think we kind of tend to take on more than we can handle. Sometimes when we’re we’re stuck here a little bit. But yeah, we do try to participate, you know, in some of the like local farm groups, I guess. And then, yeah, we always welcome talking to anybody. And just like sharing ideas, and, you know, sharing equipment and resources, and we have quite a few schools come out, and that’s kind of something that we’ve been involved in. You know, school groups like to come out and just like, look at things and kind of get an idea of, you know, is this something that they’re interested in? Or people that have horticulture classes and stuff can come and look. So we can talk to them about, like, well, this is one aspect of horticulture you can get into. And also, like, well, the different aspects of horticulture that go into this place running, you know, all the experts and sales people and vendors that we deal with. So,<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 10:56
Yeah. What sort of research sources did y’all use when you first started farming?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 11:01
As far as like, educational?<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 11:03
Yeah.<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 11:06
I mean online is, I mean, you can find so much online now, it’s just crazy. We probably didn’t do that as much as we should have started. But the extension office, I mean, they can be a really good resource, linking you up with people now and providing resources. I mean, just other farmers, Michael, you know, he’s very personable, and likes to talk to people a lot, and he’s very hard working. So I find that with Michael, like older men kind of tend to take him as like, he kind of finds mentors and partners in that aspect. So that’s probably been our biggest resource, you know, as other more established farmers. And then when you go to the market, you know, you just meet a lot of other farmers, and farmers tend to be very generous with information. It’s it is a competitive realm, but there is still plenty of room for like there’s plenty of market space right now, and people know that in order for people to be interested in buying local produce, there has to be enough of it available. It has to be kind of convenient for people. So farmers do tend to share resources very readily and share tips. And because you know that it’s hard, and like you want other people to succeed. So particularly when you go to Marcus, you start talking to other vendors and farmers while you’re there. So just, we’ve been at three or four different markets through this. So he’s met a lot of people that way. And then, I mean, yeah, just a lot of, you know, videos, online resources. That’s just a huge thing for farmers. Now, we’ve never been one, really, to go to conferences or anything. We just don’t have a lot of time to go anywhere, so.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 13:02
With y’all’s like family histories and farming, somewhat. Has that helped y’all, and especially when you were first starting farming, or what did that kind of look like for y’all?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 13:11
yeah. I mean, that’s kind of how we did get started. Michael’s family always grew a garden growing up, so he, you know, that’s kind of how, partly, how he got interested, because he did see, like, the whole cycle of growing a garden and having your own food, and then we studied natural resources at school. So he always was interested in ecology. And then when he was in college, what really got him interested is he worked for a produce company. They did like boxes, so they aggregated from a bunch of different local farmers, and then like organic suppliers, and he became their manager when he was starting to get ready at to get out of school. So one of his jobs with that position was interviewing the farmers, because they would have, like, a newsletter with like blurbs and interviews from the farmers. So he started going around talking to all these people, and he would like pick up produce and stuff from them too. And that’s how he got interested in, like the idea of of farming as a living and, you know, he also saw, like, the ecological side of it, you know. And I always knew farming as like a business and a livelihood when I was growing up. And so he started working for my dad when, like, right after we got engaged, I guess. But my dad’s dynamic was very different. It was like my dad’s family farm is a family business, but it has changed so much since the early 70s, and it’s like grown into now my brother, he farms also, but they also run like a distribution company that gets produced from Mexico and all over the East Coast. And so just the idea of farm. Mean, as like, a livelihood was always an option for like, an idea for me, I think some people don’t really think about it that much. So that is kind of how we got started. My parents told us not to. This is very difficult. It’s like, very consuming. It takes over everything. I mean, my dad worked all the time when I was growing up, a 12 hour work day was totally normal for my dad, six days a week. So I was already kind of used to that concept. But it’s not a very stable income. You know, it can be a good income, but you have to be prepared for it not to be stable so, and it’s just like, a lot of resources go into it before you ever see anything, and there’s no guarantee that you’re gonna see anything out of your money or your work. So that can be really like difficult sometimes. But so I don’t know if I’m really answering your question. I mean, that definitely was an aspect into behind why we got into it, because we had just seen people in the profession before, so, but we ended up doing it very differently than my family does, and kind of, I think then we thought we were going to sometimes, but you just kind of take the situation that you’re in and make the best of it. So.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 16:31
Yeah, and where did you also know you said his family mostly just like garden, but both of your families, were they both in North Carolina? Or was that?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 16:39
No, I grew up in the DC area. My dad- in Maryland. My dad’s family’s been there since like, 1760 so they’ve been there a really long time, and they’ve like always. My grandfather was not a career farmer. He didn’t start like farming again till he retired from the Navy. But my dad’s family had a lot of you know that’s what they did, is grew tobacco and produce in in Maryland. So<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 17:05
Okay, and as far as like, the name, like, Seven Sisters, has that been in your family before? Did you guys make up that like name, and how did where that come from?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 17:16
No, we came up with that kind of in honor of my family. There’s seven girls in my family, so and, you know, we did kind of get into this become more because of my family, I would say. And just so we were the, actually this. We were the fine farming company for a while, but then everybody kept saying it wrong. And Michael’s cousins started another farm called fine family farm. They do like cows and stuff, and they kept getting confused. So we decided to change our name to seven sisters farm, kind of in honor of my family, my dad kind of, and then also, like, after we bought this place, we kind of want to turn this place into, like a functioning property as a whole. So we kind of wanted to name this property that a little bit while we’re here. So we transitioned to a name that had less to do with our name and more to do with like the farm, yeah,<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 18:18
Um, and when y’all first started here– did y’all– how much land did y’all have initially, and how much did you use like throughout the year?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 18:27
So we when we first moved so we lived in Maryland for two years, and we could have stayed up there and continued working with my dad, but he was really on the edge of retiring, and my family kind of has all left Maryland. Now at this point, there’s only my parents and my brother,
family kind of has all left Maryland. Now at this point, there’s only my parents and my brother, and so we were concerned about starting a business up there, and then, like everybody else left, and I don’t particularly care for it. I want to get stuck up here. And things are much more, are much cheaper down here. Originally, we thought that Michael’s family was interested in farming, and so that’s part of the reason why we moved back down here. But then we found out after we moved down here, they weren’t interested in it, actually, as like a profession. So that was kind of really difficult for a while, because we were kind of really alone for a little bit doing this, but we kind of just borrowed some land from his cousin and his parents for a while. That was probably like four acres, and then we moved here. And so this property is 25 acres. It’s only about right now here we have about, like four acres in production, and then that’s like flat and usable, and that we’ve transitioned into the garden beds and the tunnels. And then we also, our neighbor lets us use about two acres. So this is the first year that we’ve used down there. So we usually have about six acres. And like production at a time. But then we grow pretty intensively. So some of it, we grow, like, three to four crops on a season. No.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 20:10
So do you then, like, rest certain beds, like during certain seasons or times of the year as well?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 20:14
Yeah, depending on, like, the sections that we looked at down there [gestures outside of the house], our intensive garden beds, we don’t as much just because how we manage them, but yes, we are trying to, and that was something like we came from a kind of much more commercial farming experience, so we had to kind of transition our thinking to this property, yeah. And so yeah, we do fallow out grounds for a season, and particularly over the winter. You know, we try to, sometimes we have to cut a crop off a little bit earlier than we would want to, but we kind of try to cut it off in enough time to get a cover crop in there for the winter time. So you’re not leaving your soil bare, or have a few areas during the season that are waiting, you know, for a particular time in the season to be planted, so that you can fallow it out for that time.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 21:09
And what sort of like watering, like technology, I guess y’all use? Do you irrigate your crops?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 21:15
Yes we do. That was a big challenge when we moved here that like, oh yeah we’re gonna do stuff. Like, yeah, we’re gonna move here. [LAUGHS] But, like, we got 25 acres, it’s gonna be great moved here, and we’re, like, a lot of stuff you gotta work on. But originally we only had the well for this house, and that was, like, we were getting up in like, the middle of the night to, like, change irrigation around, because we just didn’t have enough water and pressure at one time. So that was like a very difficult season for us. And then after a couple years of like getting established here, we were able to get a cost share with the Soil and Water District to put in a new well. So that’s really changed our operation quite a bit having enough access to water. So
we do how we water depends on what crop it is, what stage of growth it’s in. So we do use drip irrigation, which is like tapes that you lay down your bed, and they have like little emitters in them, so those just only soil irrigate. They’re much more efficient water usage, but sometimes it’s difficult because the water doesn’t spread like you need it to. And so we also use, like, a couple different sprinkler and Mister systems depending on what stage the crop is in or what crop it is. So yeah, Michael’s pretty good with all of that. That’s something that he does for other people. Sometimes help them, like design and purchase their irrigation supplies. So.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 22:51
Yeah, and would y’all consider yourself like organic farming, or would it be something different for y’all?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 22:57
No, we’re not organic. I mean, we’re not conventional, as far as a lot of the stuff we don’t do and won’t do, but right now, you know, if we do need to you, we are not a completely like no spray program, which is not organic in general. I mean, there’s lots of stuff that can be labeled organic and certified, but we have not chosen to let go that direction strictly because it’s just really difficult in the southeast to grow economically that way, because this is a business, we feel like we have to be open to doing some stuff that you know will make sure that we Do you have a crop? But a lot of like, our intensive beds have moved. I mean, we focus number one on soil health, because we have seen that, like, the healthier that your soil is, and the healthier your plants are that you put out there, you know, the less you have to treat anything. So that’s kind of been our first line of defense on using less products. And you know, we’ve seen that we’ve probably reduced chemical usage by since we started, I would say 50% because we don’t really do like some people are on a spray program where they just like spray every week regardless, because that’s their cash crop, and they have so much of it that they can’t risk any, you know, issues with it getting started. But we only spray on, like, a treatment basis. So we found, like, there’s quite a few crops that don’t require any treatment all season. So that’s kind of been our goal is to, just like, improve the health of the farm. But, you know, some people that we’ve talked to, it is hard because it’s, you know, you have to have ideals, but you also can’t put, like, the chicken before the egg, sometimes, because sometimes, if you can’t get started enough economically, because you’re, like, holding on. Something that you want, then you can’t really ever get there, because you can’t get your feet under you to gain a market, or to, like, learn even how to really grow products if you never can see them to fruition. Sometimes. Yeah, so.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 25:17
Yeah. And have you noticed, like, an increase in, like, interest in the organic type, or, like, at least the labeling of organic. And like, how would y’all feel about that as a business? Just,<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 25:26
Um, it can be really difficult sometimes, because, you know, we do get that question a lot, like, are you organic? But there is a misconception, like, about what organic is. So it’s hard, because are you organic? But there is a misconception, like, about what organic is. So it’s hard, because if you don’t have enough time to have, like, a conversation about what you do exactly. Versus like, you know, something can be labeled organic on a shelf, but versus like, you know what they’re doing in California, where a lot of organic products are on a regular spray schedule. I mean, I think that there is an increased interest, but there’s also an increased interest in bringing your production more local, because I think people are seeing that our supply chain is very is not as stable as they thought it was. So. I mean, I think people are interested in spending their dollars locally, somebody that’s producing locally so that it’s not affected by supply chain issues. And you know, if you have time to have a conversation with people, people are interested in eating more healthily. And as far as, like, organic, when you talk about like spraying, I mean soil health is just like, your number one factor, really, because it’s sometimes about, like, what goes on the product as what is going into the product as it’s growing. And so I think people are starting to see that a little bit more, and you can see the nutritional difference in fresh vegetables versus, like, even if you’re buying something organic at the grocery store, if it’s not that fresh, it doesn’t have, like, the nutritional value, that’s something that was picked two days ago that you’re buying at the farmers market has, and so, I mean, I think as we see that, more you do get some customers, I like when you say, No, we cannot be considered organic. That’s just the end of the conversation. But a lot of people, when you talk to them, but I think there is more interest in eating, like whole foods, I guess you would say,<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 27:31
And remind me real quick, what year did y’all like establish as even fine farming company, like in this area?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 27:38
We started growing at my dad’s for ourselves in 2012<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 27:44
Okay, and since then, have you noticed an increase in, like, maybe attendance to your farm stands or like farmers markets that you’ve gone to? Have you noticed, like, customer fluctuation throughout the years, or like, interest?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 27:59
Some. it’s different. It kind of does fluctuate a little bit. You know, we’ve been to several different kinds of markets, and when we went down to Charlotte, like when we were in Greensboro, that was our main market at first, and you saw a lot of people there, foot traffic. But that doesn’t always translate to sales. Yeah, so when we moved to Charlotte, the Charlotte market, it had just started. That was its first year. You know, took it a while to build out, because I was like COVID And like all the social unrest and things, but we definitely have seen an increase in steady patronage, yeah, people that are deciding that that’s where they want to put their dollars and that’s where they’re going to spend their money, we do find that people are very careful how they spend their money, and more and more so. So, you know, you do have to make sure that your product is worth the money that they’re willing to pay for it. But it
is hard because I think with how busy people schedule is, I mean, we always tell people when they come like that, we appreciate it, because we are another stop for them, or where they’re taking their time out of their day on Saturday to come. So you know, it is hard because my dad used to always say, my parents are in a farm stand for a long time. He’s like, you know, people think that, like, price is king. He’s like, convenience is king and price is the queen. So it’s like, you know, trying to cater to that is kind of a difficult thing to play, but I think, yeah, we have seen an increase in, like steady customers, and part of it is demographics, people that are moving around from this area. But I get, like started,<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 29:57
I was gonna ask what like animal or pest has been the biggest threat to your crops?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 30:04
in North Carolina, probably funguses actually, like it’s very this year was very nice. It was not human this year, not high. We did not have a lot of brain. I mean, comparatively this year, we had so few issues with that kind of stuff. But here, fungal diseases are your most difficult, and that is why it is really difficult to, like, be organically certified in this particular climate, because there is not, like, there’s a lot of organically certified insecticides. But as far as fungicides go. There’s just not a whole lot of options. So that’s why it is more difficult. But yeah, I mean, there’s just like, because sometimes when once a fungal issue gets into your product, it just, like, spreads, and there’s not really as much you can do about it, because a lot of it is weather dependent. That’s why we have moved a lot to the tunnels, because the tunnels protect your product from so that’s one of the reasons we’ve transitioned more and more and put more investment in the tunnels, because just the Climate Control that they offer is definitely worth the investment. Even in North Carolina, you don’t need them as much for like winter protection as you know, protecting your product from the rain and only watering it when it’s necessary, and just being able to have that little bit more of control against the elements is a huge advantage.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 31:44
How many structures do y’all have currently for that purpose?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 31:48
We have seven that are what we call high tunnels, because they’re unheated. And then we have one that we call the propagation house, because it is like a heated, temperature controlled environment.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 31:59
Yeah. When did y’all first, like, establish your use of, like, a covered environment like that before?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 32:06
Um, probably, I think in 2016. We built our first one at Michael’s parents. It just was, like something that we tried out. And then Michael built that one in 2019 the first one that we had. And then he’s kind of put one or two up every season.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 32:23
Since then, have y’all had any problems with animals at all?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 32:28
Not too much. We really are. People are very surprised this property. That’s one of the advantages of it is it’s like, very open. So deer do not like this property because we get a lot of wind, and their scent really carries, and we have a lot of like corridors that take them around where we are. Rodents. We keep two dogs outside all the time, so we really find they’ve been pretty effective. One of the things my dad had the most, I mean, my dad pretty much had to stop farming because of animal pressure. One of them was groundhogs, and I’ve seen a couple around here, so I’m really not looking forward to that, because they’re very difficult to get rid of, and can, like, eradicate but no, luckily, that has not been something we’ve had an issue with.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 33:17
Yeah, that’s great. Um, so in terms of, like, your family’s history with, like, your parents and all that, you mentioned something about, like, was it the 1760s or something like that, yeah, so do you know, like, what historically your family grew before?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 33:33
A lot of tobacco. The area where I grew up was big in tobacco growing. It was close to the Chesapeake Bay and the river, so they have, like, a lot of transportation opportunities for that. So yeah, tobacco was probably, like the main cash crop that my family grew for a long time. And then my dad, when he was growing up, his father was Admiral in the Navy, so he just only did, like, a few crops. So they did tobacco and cows when he was growing up. And then in the 70s, they transitioned, started transitioning to produce again. After that, my great grandfather, he did grow quite a bit of produce, and we were close to DC, and so my dad said that he would get up at like two in the morning and load up his horse and buggy and take his produce in and sell it downtown DC at the markets there in like the late 1800s<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 34:28
Yeah. Did y’all already have family in the area when y’all moved to North Carolina, you mentioned it felt kind of like isolating a little bit at first.
mentioned it felt kind of like isolating a little bit at first.<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 34:36
Michael’s fam- This is where Michael grew up. Yeah. So his family loves just a couple minutes his parents and his brother, but we kind of took on a very different lifestyle than they had. His parents were both teachers, so they really were not I mean, they were supportive in this endeavor, as of like helping us take care of our kids and like helping us do things we need. To do. But as far as like, the idea of us doing it, they didn’t really like it. They didn’t really think it was, like, very secure. They thought we just, like, worked all the time, which we did. So yeah, so that was, like, kind of isolating, because we did just work all the time, and even though Michael was from here, we really didn’t have a lot of time to make friends or even see his old friends, and then at that point, he used to run markets three days a week, Friday through Sunday, so we, like, weren’t going to church, and so yeah, that was a really difficult period for us. We almost moved back to Maryland to be with my family,<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 35:43
Was the decision to focus on what y’all do, like with the type of produce y’all make, was that decision a pretty natural one? Or like, what factors went into that?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 35:50
Yeah, that’s kind of what we knew was vegetable production. And my family had, at one point, a really diverse produce farm, because they sold at markets also, and then they also had a big farm stand. And we just like growing the variety, like, we only really ever knew annual vegetable production, like looking back, or, like, maybe we could have gotten to meat or something else that’s a little bit less. It takes, like, a lot of mental energy to produce the variety, but we kind of fell into farmers markets, because that’s where your profit margins are for our size. And like we always talk about, like scaling down our variety a little bit, but we just really like having so much product. It’s really exciting. It’s exciting for our customers. Like, it’s really nice for your kitchen. And that’s kind of been our goal is, like, I guess, like, our motto right now is, you know, we feed families like, that’s kind of been our goal since we’ve been doing this. Or Michael likes to say, seven sisters farm. We grow good food, yeah? So just like, Yeah, I don’t we have scaled back a few a little bit on variety, but I think as long as we continue farming, that’s going to kind of be our main focus is, you know, growing a large variety of products for people to really enjoy cooking in their kitchen.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 37:30
Yeah, um, do y’all use any I know you mentioned before, using H-2A, have you historically used H-2A, or was that a more recent?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 37:30
That was recent, that was just this year. Was our first season with guys. We have used a lot of
local labor in the past. I mean, I used to be much more. I used to work 50 to 60 hours a week and do a lot more of the labor myself, but I just had to really step back to like a management position. But, yeah, no, that’s recent. We used a lot of local labor in the past. We’ve just found it’s really, it’s difficult to get the hours that you need. And you know, it’s hard because that somebody stopped by yesterday to talk about it, and it’s hard because the farm is, like, very consuming so and it’s very time sensitive, so it’s hard kind of to have people that are, like, obligated to other things. But it just used to be Michael and I, it was fine. But you know, these guys, they’re experienced in agriculture. They come here to work like, this is what they come to do. So it’s nice you can just, like, lay out their day, and that’s what they come to do. And like, they don’t really have a lot of distractions, is one of the biggest bonuses. And so, and I mean, it’s hard in farming, there’s not, you know, a lot of money to go around. So by the time you’re getting into, like, the work ethic that you need here, a lot of those people in, you know, our culture, they’re the ones that have really, like, risen above to, you know, either they want to do this themselves and so they’re looking to move on after a couple years, or they’re, you know, somebody that’s going to be promoted pretty quickly, because you do have to have, like, a certain attention to detail and a work ethic, and those kind of people, there’s just not a lot more that we can offer them. So they can stay here for a while. But because there’s not, like, usually, a lot more that you can offer, they tend to move on to, you know, some type of more career focused environment. No,<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 39:46
Have you all enjoyed, like, has it helped production or anything like that with the H-2A workers?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 39:50
Yeah, it has. They’re very they’re just very meticulous. We found very quality driven, you know, I think you. Can get like, we’ve been really blessed. Our guys are very nice, very just like, really nice family guys. I think, you know, you don’t know who you’re hiring sometimes, so I think sometimes you can have more issues. But we’ve been, yeah, the production, you know, it’s nice, because you can give them a task and show them how it’s done, and they’re they don’t cut corners. So, and that’s kind of where we found the difficulty before. I was like, you would give people tasks, but you come back and it’s kind of just like, not really what you expected it to be. So, yeah, it’s been a big and just like, reliability. That’s was one of our issues before. You know, Michael was getting a lot of call outs at six in the morning. I can’t come to work, and he, you know, that’s really difficult for us, because the work doesn’t wait. So that was one of the reasons that we did decide to pursue this program, because we just with all our kids and with this like we really just had to have people that were going to be at work every day. So that’s been a big difference.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 41:05
Yeah, throughout the years. Have there any big like, have there been any big like, either law or policy changes that have affected your work at all?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 41:15
For our scale? Not particularly yet, there has been, there is, like an interest, I think, politically, in stabilizing our food system. Because you see, you know, your farms are either going one of two directions. They’re either getting smaller and they’re selling at a local market level, or they’re getting much, much bigger. And, you know, they’re just turning, I mean, not conglomerates, but they’re turning into more of, like, a corporation, kind of industrial, yeah, just because of your economies of scale, the middle, like the middle sized farm, can’t survive anymore. It’s just very difficult, because if you can’t get your retail price point, but you’re trying to sell wholesale, which is like, where my dad was, he was growing like 100 acres of produce. So you can’t be efficient enough to sell to, you know, your corporate distributors, but you also are too big to sell like retail, so those people are really getting squeezed out. Those are the people that are having most difficulty. So we’ve seen that there is, like a big push in federal money to support smaller farmers, because they do see that it’s going to be a big aspect, a bigger aspect, I think of, I can’t think of, like your local of your food system. So we have seen more money going towards that, more opportunities like, we’ve been able to get several grants, mostly to help with infrastructure improvement. So that’s, you know, been a big help for us. There’s something else I was gonna say, I forgot, but yeah, that’s kind of the biggest thing, I think. And then, truthfully, one of the bigger things that we’ve seen, I mean, policy wise, I guess, is, like the Food and Nutrition Assistance Program, you know, they’ve really expanded that to try to focus people on, like, farmers markets and more nutritious food. So they’ve been working with the market that we’re at in Charlotte and a couple other markets to try to encourage people to spend money at those places, you know, instead of on processed food at the grocery store. So we’ve seen, like, a lot of that money come through like our market avenues for us and for other growers. There’s something else I was gonna talk about, but I don’t remember now.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 43:54
I know this year we’ve had a lot more heat. Has that affected your crops this year at all or no?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 44:00
See, this year we thought was more mild, so, I don’t know, yeah, metal. Maybe it’s our location, or we have, like, I mean, I guess it stayed, it stayed warmer longer, but it was, like, more mild temperatures. So we’ve actually had a really good growing year. The year before last? Well, I mean, I think it does. It’s more difficult, watering, wise, to keep up with the heat. And then also, like, the rate of your crop growth changes. And also, we found that our fall actually has gotten pushed later and later. We used to plant lettuces and some of the other stuff a little bit earlier, but now sometimes it’s staying hotter more into September, October. You know, you’re like. Temperatures were not very extreme this year, but we had more 80 degrees in October than we usually had. So that’s difficult for your fall. All crops, they just don’t. They don’t manage well with that. So we found we had to adjust some plantings stuff we typically would have planted earlier and had available earlier in the year. We’ve had to push a little bit later.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 45:14
Yeah, um, let me see. So with your kids on the farm, have Do they like get to surname and start helping out. So far. Have you seen any interest from them?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 45:23
Yeah, our oldest son, particularly, he’s, that’s just his personality. He’s been doing things since he was two, three years old, wanting to be out there helping. And so our other sons, yeah, they, they do show interest also, and they’re out there, you know, particularly with Michael, that’s one of the reasons that we do like this. That’s kind of a hard balance, because we are always at work, so you’re like, kind of separating your mind doesn’t happen very well, but, um, but Michael also is able to be with the boys a lot, and they will go out there and help him, and he can teach them a lot of stuff. So so we’ll see. I mean, we do when they work on the farm and they’re actually working, they do get paid for that. So we kind of keep track of their time and pay them for work on the farm. It’s not really like an expected thing out of them. So we want them to learn, like, this is how we make our money. So it is important. And like, if you want to contribute, then, like, you can make money and start having your own money to do things with too. So because the more you do, the less we have to pay somebody else to do so, you know, we can keep it as, like, a family, things in the family. So,<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 46:43
yeah, um, in your like, I guess you’ve had many years now of like, experience on this specific area. Um, throughout that time, did you ever have a moment where you’re kind of like, okay, we got this or, like, you know, like a success milestone, somewhat even just like, emotionally feeling a bit more?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 47:02
I don’t, that’s Michael’s personality. I am not a very contented personality. But sometimes, I mean, when I had our fourth child, and things kind of went along really smoothly, actually, after that, I was kind of like, well, maybe we can, maybe we can do this. And I mean, I have like, moments like that. I’m very, like, product focused. So for me, those little moments come, like, when I see the product and it’s all out, and I’m like, okay, like, this is why we’re doing this. I’m always gonna feel like stuff not good enough, or like out of control or but I think Michael definitely this season’s been hard for him managing the guys, because it’s like a different work atmosphere for him. But I think you know, this is men particularly. This is like, where their ego and their pride comes in. So for him, yeah, I think just like this building that he’s done, and he started getting calls for people to build things for them, and he has a contract with the Randolph County schools to help them with, like, some of their horticulture program infrastructure. And so I think, yeah, that’s been a big thing for him. He also has worked several other jobs, like, in between this, he hasn’t done this full time all the time, and I think just feeling like this is something that you know he can do full time. And this is kind of all he does. He does his Yeah, bend up a big milestone for him.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 48:49
Do y’all see any like incoming, like, ways you can grow or changes that you’re planning for in the next year, or, like, just in the future in general?<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 48:56
Um, yeah, I think that we will scale back on the produce production to a certain extent, and he will probably take on some more building work and like landscape improvement work, just Because the produce production takes so much like mental energy and time, and it is very difficult, like your product is perishable, so you only you know it’s just very time sensitive, which is pretty stressful on your business in your family. So he would like to expand a little bit more into some consulting and some building projects, and kind of be able, because if we could scale back the farm production a little bit, we also could, you know, fine tune our production methods, some which we would like to do. But yeah, we kind of always have different ideas. Michael says that, like the farmers, like. The nucleus, and that’s how, you know, getting this place started and getting our markets going is kind of how we’re able to all be here as a family. And then, you know, as the kids get older, we can kind of see what direction. You know, things take you in. The market takes you in. Your kids interests take you in. So<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 50:19
Um, would you have any like, I guess, closing advice for anyone, like, starting a farm, or, like, in general, like something you wish you would have known at the beginning? Um,<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 50:23
I would say, go visit more farms and talk to people and work for people. It is hard to go work for other farmers, because there’s not a lot of money. It’s terrible, but you don’t make a lot of money working for another farmer. But if it’s something that you really think you want to do, you know you might have to be willing to sacrifice some time to go learn from somebody else, because you’re just going to save so much money and time later on in the end. And I mean, I guess just don’t be afraid to consolidate your market. I mean, we kind of came from a different background, where stuff was a lot bigger and we had to consolidate down. But I mean, really learn your market and learn where your market niche is, because there are a lot of market niches out there, and you know, you have to be willing to adapt to that, because trends are changing all the time. But let’s just be prepared for like you always hope that it won’t take over everything, but it kind of just does. It’s kind of the nature of the beast of farming. I think it’s like a problem that every farmer that you talk to where it’s just like a very consuming profession. It’s like having another baby because it needs you all the time, so I guess just be prepared mentally, like if that’s what you really want or not.<\/p>\r\n
Maryevelyn Murray 52:07
Yeah, awesome. Well, thank you for your time.<\/p>\r\n
Janice Fine 52:10
Oh yeah.<\/p>\r\n
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